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Post by DMC on May 22, 2015 14:22:48 GMT
So there's quite the fervor and controversy over the latest episode with Sansa and her wedding night to Ramsay. My favorite GoT podcast (Podcast Winterfell) even quit covering the show over it, which sucks.
While I see the darkness and brutality of it for what it is, I don't understand the backlash.
Anyone else have thoughts?
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Post by friartook on May 22, 2015 17:17:39 GMT
I am not up to date on the show, nor have I seen the episode. But here are my thoughts on this: 1. If you are a fan of the GoT show, or books, you should expect to be subjected to harsh, horrid events. I'm not really sure why this particular scene has caused such a fervor. 2. The use of rape as a plot device should be used sparingly and its harshness and horror should be emphasized. Not sure if anyone here has read Peter V. Brett's The Warded Man series. There is a scene in that series where a character is raped, and the horror of it gets deep into your bones. The entire time you are waiting for the author to stop it, for a hero to jump in, for the victim to miraculously escape. But no punches are pulled. It is an amazing piece of writing that sends a knife deep into your guts and twists. As it should. One criticism I have heard is that the scene was added merely to cause controversy and shock. If that is true, then it is a valid criticism. Horrid events in well written stories should horrify. If you aren't horrified, then there is a lack of connection to the characters which likely speaks to poor writing (that, or you are a sociopath ). Ultimately, it is up us as consumers to choose what we consume. By watching a show (or reading books) like GoT, you are agreeing to be subjected to possible horrific plot twists. You agree, by consuming these creations, to be subjected such harsh emotional treatment. If you can't handle it, or are going to outraged by what you see, then vote with your "dollar" and consume something else.
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Post by DMC on May 22, 2015 17:28:20 GMT
One criticism I have heard is that the scene was added merely to cause controversy and shock. I've heard that too, and it's why the podcaster I mentioned previously, said he is quitting the show. I agree with him on his point, but I don't think that's why it happened in the show. It happens in the book (worse there, actually), as a pivotal moment to snap Theon out of his Reek-state. Granted, it's a different person in the book (Jayne Poole), but the plot device was a necessary one. Besides, I don't think GoT needs controversy or shocking things to get people talking about it. It's the #1 most downloaded/pirated show, and HBO even pushed their HBO:NOW service to be ready in time for the S5 premier. People are already talking about it on Mondays at the water cooler. They don't need to shock, for shock's sake.
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Post by joatmoniac on May 22, 2015 21:09:27 GMT
I find it intriguing that the scene was the breaking point for so many, or at least so many vocal people. There has been a lot that I would think fits into a very similar mold to that scene. I wonder what the numbers will actually look like going forward. Also, GoT Rule #1: NEVER EVER EVER get married ... EVER!
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Post by friartook on May 22, 2015 21:25:02 GMT
Also, GoT Rule #1: NEVER EVER EVER get married ... EVER! Good advice all around?
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Post by frohtastic on May 22, 2015 22:02:26 GMT
I'm not really sure what to make of the derailment they've done between the books and the tv-show. not sure if I like where Sansa-show is now in contrast to where she is in the books, where she/littlefinger consolidates the power of the vale.
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Post by friartook on May 29, 2015 20:21:30 GMT
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Post by joatmoniac on May 29, 2015 21:25:57 GMT
Even though he only wrote one for each of the first four seasons would envision he was just generally more involved because of that. I think they are right that this will only further divide the tv and book camps. Also, I thought it was supposed to be a seven book series not eight, but it would appear I was wrong, haha.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2015 19:01:16 GMT
Yeah, I just can't see Martin's novels keeping up with the pace of the TV production schedule, at least not to run season to season continuously. I'd be all for a TV spinoff in the same setting to fill in a year or two while the man takes time to finish his opus. There's lots of room in the world to explore, and fantastic screen writers to fill in the blanks without treading on Martin's vision.
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Post by friartook on May 30, 2015 19:19:50 GMT
For my part, I am all done. I was dubious of the show until I learned Martin had writing cred on the screenplays. Now, with all the divergence I've seen and heard, and with the large number of other excellent things to watch in the TV space...well, I'll just patiently wait for the next book...like I've been doing for years.
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Post by DMC on Jun 1, 2015 16:13:13 GMT
Done? No way. This show is bad-ass. However, with S3 and S4 being all from one book, I don't know why they can't stretch out the seasons longer. This year they went the opposite route and compressed all of Book 4 and Book 5 into one season, nixing a ton of material. Unless they save the Ironborn Asha/Victarion stuff for S6? I'm viewing the show and books as separate entities. I can fully enjoy both quite well. And last night.......daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaamn, son! I actually suspect the cloaked boatman is an important player. Camera never showed him, and it was shot very suspiciously. Not to mention the fact that there were hundreds, if not thousands of people rushing the boats Titanic-style, and yet....one boat remained untouched? Just sitting there on the dock, dude with his back to the shore, chilling out like a sunny afternoon. Benjin perhaps? My son and I both thought the giant was gonna fall, and then rise up undead from the water. THAT would have been bad-ass. Kiddo even said... "Dad, it'd be a...wait for it...GREAT WIGHT!" Love that kid. Valyrian Steel is only in 3 places that we know of. 'Longclaw' (Jon Snow), and the Tywin-melted down 'Ice', which is now 'Widow's Wail' (Goffrey?), and 'Oathkeeper' (Brienne). I think it'd be easier to come up with Obsidian, than to find and forge a rare steel. From previous episodes though, it sounds like the ore can be found, but that "There's not many in the seven kingdoms that can forge Valyrian Steel." Maybe you need dragon-fire to temper the ore? Ice was melted down into two blades, but the raw, pre-forged material was already there. Blacksmithing isn't my lane though, so I have no idea.
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Lekai
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Posts: 20
Favorite D&D Class: Rogue
Favorite D&D Race: Human
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Post by Lekai on Jun 1, 2015 19:01:23 GMT
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Post by friartook on Jun 1, 2015 19:14:32 GMT
There's lots of room in the world to explore, and fantastic screen writers to fill in the blanks without treading on Martin's vision. This speaks a lot to why I am "done". I should perhaps amend that to "done until the books are finished". GoT is an amazing show; its well written, amazingly well casted, well acted and well produced. I'm not trying to get down on it. But I really love Martin's books and his vision of the world. I want to see that come to fruition. I also do not have HBO, so perhaps I could further amend my statement to say: "I'm done pining for/debating whether or not to pay for, GoT." I'll hold off, wait patiently for Martin to finish his books, and watch the seasons at my leisure some time in the future. There is so much good stuff to consume out there, but only so much time and money to go around. I'll read The Grace of Kings by Ken Liu, Seveneves by Neal Stephenson, and watch Daredevil, finish watching Breaking Bad and catch up on Walking Dead for now.
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Lekai
Commoner
Posts: 20
Favorite D&D Class: Rogue
Favorite D&D Race: Human
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Post by Lekai on Jun 1, 2015 23:47:13 GMT
Be done after S5E8. It will be worth it.
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Post by DMC on Jun 8, 2015 17:42:26 GMT
DROGON!!!
That is all.
\m/
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