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Post by friartook on May 18, 2015 16:48:09 GMT
Here's the situation: My group has been questing through this giant tree, which they have now reached the top of. Our last session ended with this tree being torn asunder and collapsing. This tree is huge; really huge. I keep telling the players that they are 2000 above the ground, but that's just a number I've thrown out to illustrate the fact that if they fall, they will die.
Here's the dilemma: The players are at the top of the tree, and its collapsing! I've got one player hanging from a rope, three in the bowl of the trunk (which just broke open), and two riding/being carried by a couatle. I can't decide how to handle the collapse that needs to happen at the top of tonight's session. Do I hand wave this and allow them all to survive? If so, how would that look? Do I make them all do athletics/acrobatics checks to see if they can weather the collapse? It would start slow, and be sort of majestic...but if they fail the check does that mean they fall to their death? This tree is on an island, do I hand wave and make them fall in the water thus surviving that way?
I'm looking for judgement calls on the questions above and for any out of the box solutions to this dilemma. This situation was not how I planned things to go, but is the natural result of events I set in motion as the DM and actions taken by the players. The characters are all 4th level going on 5th and the guys are pretty attached to them, so I don't want to kill them all by proxy, but realistically, it would be really really difficult to survive the situation they are in.
Ideally, I'd like to illustrate the "life on the line" aspect of the situation without just squishing them all under collapsing branches or splattering them like an egg in a failed science project.
This is for tonight's session, so feedback here is helpful up until about 9:00pm. After that, we will be in session. Any and all feedback is welcome!
Thanks in advance!
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Post by DMC on May 18, 2015 17:49:36 GMT
Allllllllllllll the way down dude. LMAO!  |
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Samuel Wise
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Post by Samuel Wise on May 18, 2015 17:51:54 GMT
Allllllllllllll the way down dude. LMAO! Legolas... sorry that is just wrong. My players couldn't do that with a nat 20. That is defying the laws of physics my elf friend... |
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Post by Deleted on May 18, 2015 17:57:25 GMT
A hand waved narration is fine, though you should give them a vivid description by which to remember it. If you want to leave their fates to the dice, first decide whether you're comfortable with Save or Die consequences.
If you aren't, have them make ability checks (more below) and suffer damage and/or lose gear on a failure. If you are, require multiple successes to escape or die (similar to death saving throws).
Some example checks, hope this gives you some good ideas:
The bowl of the trunk splits open, separating the three who were standing there. Each makes a dexterity check to avoid getting tossed from the tree, or getting hit by a branch collapsing from above. On a failure, he takes bludgeoning damage from a falling branch, or falls off a ledge. He must make another dex check to catch himself. On a second failure, his gear gets snarled on a branch. He must make an athletics check to free himself. On a third failure, he becomes hopelessly stuck, and will have to release his backpack to escape.
The guy on the rope must make an athletics check to climb up to the branch from which it hangs. On a failure, he gets smacked by a falling branch and takes damage. If he fails again, the branch he's hanging from splits and he falls. He lands on a lower branch, suffering additional damage, but this one isn't very stable either. He makes a perception check. On a success, he sees a series of branches and footholds he can easily use to get to a safe spot, but on a failure, he thinks he sees the same... but it proves to be quite unstable.
Couatl is by default a medium sized creature. I assume this one is quite large, to have two people riding it? Is this creature supposed to be their escape route? The guys on the couatl can try to guide it in aiding the other players. Each player it reaches can climb aboard and be mostly safe. However, the riders will have to make a perception check to warn it of a falling branch at one point, and an animal handling check to stay mounted as it attempts a risky maneuver. At one point it will hesitate, and they have to make a persuade or intimidate check to rescue the last person. Failure on check means a player doesn't get rescued that round. Success means another player gets rescued. Anyone who was rescued does not make these checks.
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Post by friartook on May 18, 2015 17:59:16 GMT
THIS IS EXACTLY MY DILEMMA!
I'm thinking about opening this up for discussion with the group. Just making it a question, "Ok guys, how realistic do you want this campaign to be?" I know their answer, but the only ways I can think of dealing with this are either too harsh (everyone not on a flying celestial being is dead) or to soft (you all miraculously survive a fall from 2000 feet amidst a storm of breaking branches and debris). So we'll see what they have to say about it.
Edit: Sorry, this was in response to DMC.
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Samuel Wise
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Post by Samuel Wise on May 18, 2015 17:59:22 GMT
I am not sure on what basis your tree is 'collapsing'. Trees usually fall over, but don't collapse. I'm not sure if the tree 'has' to collapse, but making it fall over might be a helpful idea to saving your players (surviving inside would also be easier). Making the one on the rope (if he is outside the tree) fall into the water is not a bad idea (albeit far-fetched). But, if the tree is falling over, the man on the rope can just jump off at the right second to survive hitting the ground. It would be pretty fun to describe vein inside a falling tree.
If the tree has to collapse (or you just don't want to squish your favorite country underneath the size of this tree), then I suggest saving them by some other means. Maybe, right before they begin to fall, a wind elemental could attack them, suspending them in an air-like battle as the tree collapses around them (*hint* *hint*). That would also be fun to describe.
These are just a few, poorly thought up ideas, I am sure there are more and better ideas out there...
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Post by friartook on May 18, 2015 18:21:23 GMT
Couatl is by default a medium sized creature. I assume this one is quite large, to have two people riding it? Is this creature supposed to be their escape route? The guys on the couatl can try to guide it in aiding the other players. Each player it reaches can climb aboard and be mostly safe. However, the riders will have to make a perception check to warn it of a falling branch at one point, and an animal handling check to stay mounted as it attempts a risky maneuver. At one point it will hesitate, and they have to make a persuade or intimidate check to rescue the last person. Failure on check means a player doesn't get rescued that round. Success means another player gets rescued. Anyone who was rescued does not make these checks. The Couatl is carrying one PC who was dropped by the rogue on a rope (yup, the session went south in a big hurry last Monday), the one riding him fell from his own rope and landed on the Couatl. In my mind, the Couatl (who is in a giant bird form at this time) is at its outside carry limit and will likely be making for the ground as fast as possible. He may be a potential escape route for one more character. This is good advice nevvur, thank you. I like the idea of multiple checks like Death Saves, with escalating consequences for each failure. I'll likely have the Couatl drop off the two he's got, then go back as a possible hand wave escape route for one more who falls. |
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Post by friartook on May 18, 2015 18:42:19 GMT
If the tree has to collapse (or you just don't want to squish your favorite country underneath the size of this tree), then I suggest saving them by some other means. Maybe, right before they begin to fall, a wind elemental could attack them, suspending them in an air-like battle as the tree collapses around them (*hint* *hint*). That would also be fun to describe. The tree is collapsing because its magic matrix that created it has been compromised and the Ancient Green Dragon whose essence was bound into it to close a tear in the fabric of the world leading to the fae realm has been released. It wasn't cut down, its falling apart as if it has fast forward dry rot (hence the veiled lumberjack joke). Thanks for the reminder about that wind elemental, I forgot he was lurking back there inside the tree. Now I have to decide if that elemental would still exist given that the magic binding it to this plane may be compromised...but its a nice "hand wave" to keep in reserve  |
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Samuel Wise
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Post by Samuel Wise on May 18, 2015 19:18:29 GMT
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Post by friartook on May 19, 2015 14:37:21 GMT
The session turned out great last night all! Thanks again for your advice nevvur. It really helped get me grounded in my thinking. I ended up doing something similar to your suggestion: I allowed the players to decide what they wanted to do in the situation, then set about having them roll skill check after skill check to see if they survive. I gave them numerous chances at success and failure. The rule of thumb I created for myself is this: each life threatening situation should have at least 3 chances to survive it. Similar to death saves; three fails=death, but only one success was needed to avoid it. I thought it worked out well. Tensions were high and everyone knew they could die at any time, but there was room for everyone to survive. Everybody had their moment of "crazy" where they had to (or just chose to) do something insane to get out of their situation.
Exactly how I wanted it to go.
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Post by DMC on May 19, 2015 14:53:35 GMT
Excellent! Good to hear it all worked out.  |
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2015 17:21:20 GMT
Awesome, glad to hear it Took. I'm curious to read a more detailed account of how the scene went down.
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Post by friartook on May 19, 2015 18:02:05 GMT
Awesome, glad to hear it Took. I'm curious to read a more detailed account of how the scene went down. We all know the dangers of asking a DM to describe their campaign...you asked for it! Start of session: At the start of the session we had Ramanajan the Cleric unconscious in the claws of a Couatl in giant bird form, Balasar the fighter on the back of same gliding swiftly to the ground in a storm of debris. We had Ludwig the Sorcerer and Kant the Paladin just regaining consciousness in uppermost bowl of the tree's trunk, and Ichbar the rogue hanging by 45 feet of rope from the side of the tree. The giants that had knocked out our party members and helped cause the collapse of the tree by chopping off the branch carrying the tree's fruit were distracted by the crazed assault of the Satyr King and the structural collapse of the tree and emergence of a giant Green Dragon from the bowl of the treetop. I described the tree as split at the top where the dragon came forth, but also as suffering from fast-forward dry rot starting at its roots. So it was collapsing via a split at the peak of the trunk, but also slowly sinking like a demoed building. I had everyone go in turns as if we were in combat. I'm just going to run through a turn by turn below to illustrate what happened. I may miss or leave out details; I won't be mentioning what was rolled on, just the actions and outcomes. Balasar: Clinging to the back of an overburdened bird-couatl spinning toward the ground in a barely controlled corkscrew dive, Balasar decided to get fancy and attempt to catch a piece of falling fruit on the fly. He lost his grip, slid back on the bird, and just barely managed to catch ahold of its tail feathers. Ramanajan: regained consciousness and, being at the mercy of the bird in whose claws he awoke, stridently requested to be let down gently. Ludwig: Pulls a bolt of silk cloth and his rope from his pack and fashions a parachute. He makes a running jump and, through luck and/or skill, the parachute holds and he manages to maintain his grip on the ropes. He begins a gentle, but swift, descent. Kant: Cuts open his bedroll and ties it to his back pack to make sort of drag chute, then cuts the armor from a slain giant and drags the body to the crack widening at the center of the tree. Ichbar: pulls his daggers and releases his hold on the rope. He begins a staggered, freehand belay of the trunk, but all his efforts only allow for a controlled descent of about 6ft. Balasar: clings on for dear life Ramanajan: begs again not to be dropped Ludwig: tries to get fancy and switch from a two handed grip on the parachute ropes to a single hand grip, loses control and almost lets go of the makeshift parachute which holds together. Is now descending by a perilous one-handed clutch. Kant: Uses the giant's corpse as a sled and goes down the crack in the center of the tree. He uses his axe to slow and control the headlong rush into the decaying bore of the trunk. Ichbar: Decides he isn't making fast enough progress, so pulls free his daggers and makes a leap of faith, attempting to land on the back of the bird carrying Ramanajan and Balasar (freefall for a couple rounds) Ludwig: after a couple rounds loses his grip and falls to the earth. He chews fruit of the World Tree as he falls, and thus is healing as he strikes the ground and is merely incapacitated instead of splattered. Kant: leaps off the body of the giant as it makes the transition to the steeper slope into the bowels of the tree. Digs in his axe and attempts to ride out the collapse. Ichbar: (Here I'm going to relate some rolls and table talk, 'cause it was amazing) Ichbar rolls a d20 to see if he manages to land on the back of the bird; he rolls a 1. Everyone has used up their inspiration by this time except Kant...DM looks at Kant, "He's gonna die..." Kant shakes his head, pauses, then offers up his inspiration point, "My character is compassionate, he'd give up his inspiration for his comrade. I wouldn't, but he would." Ichbar rerolls his d20...and rolls a natural 20. He successfully lands on the back of the bird like a flying squirrel on tree branch; the flight is not even disrupted. Fast forward the rest: Everyone on the bird makes it to the ground, the Couatl changes form and swoops back up to retrieve Kant. Debris falls everywhere, Ichbar and Balasar run for the beach. Ichbar swims out into the water...Balasar decides to begin a long rest right there on the beach in the midst of a storm of falling debris. Thats what he wanted to do...what can I say. He got hit by a branch. The session ends with everyone stabilized and on the ground. A long rest begins. That's the short version. It was ridiculously tense and dramatic in session. |
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2015 19:00:28 GMT
Very cool, sounds like everyone had a blast. I'll probably do multi-check Save or Die scenario before much longer, myself. It definitely raises the stakes and creates dramatic tension. Mine is going to involve a chase scene on a high-speed, magical yacht/convertible submarine vs. an aboleth. Haven't decided who is chasing who yet, though!
You should repost this is in Stories of Awesomeness board.
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Post by joatmoniac on May 22, 2015 8:05:13 GMT
Love how it was resolved. Definitely some intense moments to be sure. I love the skill challenge idea, and hope that something official comes out for 5E. Heck, even something unofficial that I really like would be fine too, haha. Three fails in a row in a scenario like that would definitely warrant some death, and one success makes it feel right. It seems pretty solid on a per round basis and would love to see/hear of it being used more to get a better feel for how balanced that ratio is. Then again it's also dependent on where the DC is set for each of those rolls, and so on and so froth. All that to say, well done Friartook and can't wait to find out what is next for your party.
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