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Post by DMC on May 7, 2015 20:43:41 GMT
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Samuel Wise
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Favorite D&D Class: Warlock
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Post by Samuel Wise on May 7, 2015 20:50:19 GMT
I am Frackin excited!!!!! It is going to be the first adventure I will buy (as of yet, I have done everything using my own worlds). The main reason for this is because it is based of Alice in Wonderland, one of my favorite stories on earth...
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Post by DMC on May 7, 2015 21:09:00 GMT
Yeah for sure! Lots of Drizzt hate on the WOTC forums, and I suppose I get it. There is such a thing as over-saturation, but to me, simply replace him with another NPC if you want.
I'm looking most forward to the Demon Lord stats themselves. They've almost always played a really huge importance in many of my games. The most major player directly involved that my PCs ever faced, was Yeenoghu. That triple-flail of his was devastatingly wicked...as my PCs found out.
My only thing is, and it's not really a complaint since I usually transport an entire adventure into my own world, but just an observation...this is the third world-shaking event laid on the Sword Coast. That's like three 8+ earthquakes hitting SoCal in the span of a few months. Wonder why they don't let the area rest and recover? Set it somewhere else in the Realms. Develop some of that area and locale.
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Samuel Wise
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Posts: 989
Favorite D&D Class: Warlock
Favorite D&D Race: Mousefolk
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Post by Samuel Wise on May 7, 2015 21:26:54 GMT
Yeah for sure! Lots of Drizzt hate on the WOTC forums, and I suppose I get it. There is such a thing as over-saturation, but to me, simply replace him with another NPC if you want. For me and my group it is great, none of us know who Drizzt is (except for me, but that's because I can't go on the D&D website without seeing several dozen pictures of him). The art so far (at least as far as I have seen) is really good and conveys the general ideas I have for it: tribality.com/2015/05/06/rage-of-demons-storyline-art/ . I am going to try to get the rest of the "tools" I want themed from this adventure...
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Post by joatmoniac on May 7, 2015 23:10:26 GMT
I personally don't get over saturated with the character because it was that book series that really invested me into the fantasy world and all thing D&D. I can also see though how people would be over it given that Drizzt has been prominent for roughly the past 30 years, haha. I don't know if I will buy it just yet, but don't know that I will be able to stop myself, haha.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 7, 2015 23:30:01 GMT
I don't mind that Drizzt is featured in the new material. I mind that they're billing him as the feature.
"...descend into the Underdark with the iconic hero Drizzt Do’Urden..." "...Drizzt Do’Urden is sent to investigate but it will be up to you to aid in his fight..." "...legendary adventurer Drizzt..." "...adventurers travel with Drizzt..." "D&D fans will get their mettle tested just like Drizzt ..."
It makes the party sound like a bunch of lame-ass sidekicks in an epic fantasy. No thank you. I'll be replacing him with a relatively unknown NPC if I ever run this material, and likely marginalize/downplay this NPC's role in the events.
On the whole, I'm looking forward to it. Demons/devils are an object of fascination for me, much more so than the previous themes (dragons, elementals).
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Samuel Wise
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Posts: 989
Favorite D&D Class: Warlock
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Post by Samuel Wise on May 8, 2015 0:01:10 GMT
On the whole, I'm looking forward to it. Demons/devils are an object of fascination for me, much more so than the previous themes (dragons, elementals). I Certainly agree! Especially if the demons look like the pictures above (they remind me of Kronos in Wrath of the Titans)...
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Post by friartook on May 8, 2015 13:19:55 GMT
I don't mind that Drizzt is featured in the new material. I mind that they're billing him as the feature. Agreed. Feels like the same disease that has infected hollywood: "Hey, remember that [book, TV show, comic book, old movie, action figure, etc.] that we all used to like? Well I think its got a following, we should capitalize on that and do a reboot!" Come up with something new. Impress me. 'Cause so far, I'm not impressed. 5e is an amazing rule set and framework; the GAME DESIGN is amazing! But the product execution has been horrible. The books are confusing and poorly organized. The adventures are unoriginal and derivative. We have a lame duck thematic reboot of the Temple of Elemental, an "Icewind Dale" setting feature, a "Baldur's Gate" setting feature, and now we have to pull our most iconic Realms character in. Its like some exec who has never played D&D looked over a bunch of sales numbers for old franchise products and said, "Hey, we better reference all this great old stuff people love, because otherwise, nobody will be interested!" Sorry if I sound like a grouchy curmudgeon. I feel like there are conflicting agendas at WotC. There are some great initiatives happening; I love the Sage Advice columns and the Unearthed Arcana columns. And I love the use of surveys and how WotC has taken fan opinion fully to heart in their game design. But it seems like there's a big money, cross media marketing agenda as well that is stealing some of the soul of D&D. I wouldn't care so much...if I didn't care so much about the game at the heart of it all! Ok, rant over. Edit: On a positive note, I should mention that I am very, very impressed with how WotC has been releasing free supplemental PDFs of new game content. They aren't pulling the dick move of making us buy their adventures in order to get expanded classes, races, spells, etc. I find it reassuring that there are people high enough up in the architecture of WotC to make a pro-fan choice like that. All the reboot stuff really gets my goat; I hate to see creations (art?) I love get worked over in name of $$ (and I did love the Drizzt books and character).
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Samuel Wise
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Favorite D&D Class: Warlock
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Post by Samuel Wise on May 8, 2015 14:00:16 GMT
Edit: On a positive note, I should mention that I am very, very impressed with how WotC has been releasing free supplemental PDFs of new game content. They aren't pulling the dick move of making us buy their adventures in order to get expanded classes, races, spells, etc. I find it reassuring that there are people high enough up in the architecture of WotC to make a pro-fan choice like that. This is one of the things that actually attracted me to D&D. After several years playing Games Workshop, I was tired of all the friggin money you have to pay (and as soon as your done paying, they have a whole new rule book you need in order to continue playing). The sheer amount of money invested did not add up to the amount of models, books, and accessories I own for that game. D&D is cheep, in my opinion more fun (apples and oranges), and is not obviously trying to rip you off on every corner...
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Post by DMC on May 8, 2015 14:08:25 GMT
I'd have to concur. 5E has great game design, poor story elements so far. As for Drizzt's billing in the game...from what I've seen, his mention has been limited to the Neverwinter add-on. I don't recall any of Nevvur's tag-lines attached to the actual TTRPG material. I'm sure he'll be in there as an NPC quest-giver, direction pointer, but I'm hoping that's it. My younger kids though, just getting into D&D, will love him. My son in particular. I have a 90-minute commute each way to work and back, so we've been listening to the audio books over the past few months. We've done all the Icewind Dale trilogy, Homeland Trilogy, Dark Elf Trilogy, and Passage to Dawn so far. He loves the Companions. That's why I love new players/kids in the game. You can use the stuff we're tired off, and stereotypical tropes to begin with, but to them, it's fresh and new. PS - I wonder if this means we'll get new Errtu?!?! Loves me some Balors! Especially him!
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Post by friartook on May 8, 2015 14:20:09 GMT
Edit: On a positive note, I should mention that I am very, very impressed with how WotC has been releasing free supplemental PDFs of new game content. They aren't pulling the dick move of making us buy their adventures in order to get expanded classes, races, spells, etc. I find it reassuring that there are people high enough up in the architecture of WotC to make a pro-fan choice like that. This is one of the things that actually attracted me to D&D. After several years playing Games Workshop, I was tired of all the friggin money you have to pay (and as soon as your done paying, they have a whole new rule book you need in order to continue playing). The sheer amount of money invested did not add up to the amount of models, books, and accessories I own for that game. D&D is cheep, in my opinion more fun (apples and oranges), and is not obviously trying to rip you off on every corner... FYI: This is completely new as far as I know. If they did this sort of free PDF release stuff with 4e, I never heard about it. 3.5's theme was "Drown 'em in splat books!", but that was balanced by the OGL, allowing others to legally create content using the 3.5 rule set (origins of Pathfinder RPG).
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Samuel Wise
Demigod
Ready to Help...
Posts: 989
Favorite D&D Class: Warlock
Favorite D&D Race: Mousefolk
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Post by Samuel Wise on May 8, 2015 14:49:56 GMT
FYI: This is completely new as far as I know. If they did this sort of free PDF release stuff with 4e, I never heard about it. 3.5's theme was "Drown 'em in splat books!", but that was balanced by the OGL, allowing others to legally create content using the 3.5 rule set (origins of Pathfinder RPG). This might be true (I am not sure, haven't played any other edition). I like the fact that you do not need to upgrade to the next D&D core rules and you don't really need all three core rule books. There are still people playing 3.5e!!! Some other games require you to be "caught up" when it comes to rules and other things...
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Post by DMC on May 8, 2015 15:05:15 GMT
The only time you need to update to a newer version of D&D, is if you want to, or if you're playing official Adventurer's League stuff. Home games can be whatever edition the DM and table want.
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Post by joatmoniac on May 8, 2015 17:20:30 GMT
Sorry if I sound like a grouchy curmudgeon. I feel like there are conflicting agendas at WotC. It makes sense that Drizzt would bring out the curmudgeon in some people, because unlike your Hollywood example where they are bringing something back after 30 years (i.e. National Lampoon's Vacation ...) Drizzt has been getting at least a novel's worth of content every single year for the past 30. The second sentenced I have quoted is really the one that hit home for me. It is perfection in its simplicity and I hadn't been able to put those words to it until now. When Wizards bought D&D it was plain to see that they assumed it could/would be this cash cow akin to Magic the Gathering, and their attempts to reach a more video game centric audience with 4E and the mind numbing amount of supplementals in 3.5 are proof enough of that. However, on a granular level the individual people that work on the game love it, and have likely loved it for longer than some of us have been alive. So that passion bleeds through in the articles on the site, and the small things here and there, but it is hard to see that once you get to the big D&D picture. I LOVE the new edition, but agree that the adventures so far are good, but not great. I am also waiting to see what the next rule book is before I make my final judgement on the edition. As I think that rulebook will help define the long term vision that WotC has for 5E, but who knows, maybe we won't see a rulebook, but instead have the supplemental pdfs and make a compilation of those. Regardless, good times will be had by all!
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Post by friartook on May 8, 2015 17:46:26 GMT
The only time you need to update to a newer version of D&D, is if you want to, or if you're playing official Adventurer's League stuff. Home games can be whatever edition the DM and table want. This is the very essence of what fans find so amazing about D&D, and what makes D&D difficult to monetize on a Hasbro level. Once we have the rules in our hands, we can do whatever we want with them. I spent the money on my 2e Advanced books over 20 years ago, when D&D was still owned by TSR, and I can still sit down with them and run a 2e game with $0.00 profit to WotC. This is the cognitive dissidence WotC staff face. They have to satisfy long standing fans of a much loved game who already have the resources to play said game, but also have to feed the corporate monkey on their back and find an angle to bring in new players. I feel for them, as its clear many of them share the same love of the game we have. Its just frustrating to see the ugliness leaking out. Joatmoniac: From what I've heard from WotC staff in social media or the press, they are pretty unlikely to release any new rulebooks any time soon. They've made it clear that, for the next couple years at least, they plan on releasing story driven content with supplemental expansion rules included. The good news there is they are releasing the expansions of the rules for free independent of the story content.
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